Stamped Concrete Roof Deck Question to Expert Leads to Duradek’s Ultra Tiledek

Home Improvement expert Shell Busey has been advising BC home owners for decades on how to best maintain and improve their homes.  A question on a stamped concrete roof deck was raised this summer and was featured in the Vancouver Province Newspaper Q&A Feature ‘Ask Shell’.

Shell, who is very familiar with roof deck waterproofing solutions from a long relationship with Duradek as one of his House Smart Referral Certified products summed it up succinctly with “…always use Duradek Tiledek.”

Vancouver Province Clipping - June 2015

The Q&A article in Ask Shell “Remedying a leak on stucco”, was as follows:

Q: I have an above-ground deck half over my garage and half over the driveway. The deck has a torch down covering with stamped concrete on top.

The problem is that the deck leaks at the seam where it meets the stucco side of the house.

It is a slow leak, but I do not want to end up having damage to the stucco.

I have put caulking along the seam; it sticks well to the stucco, but not the concrete. Is there a better product I can use?

A: It sounds as though the contractor did not install a metal counter flashing when the deck was built.

A 90-degree metal counter flashing could have been cut into the stucco and placed under the concrete decking to give the best water seal.

You might still be able to have a flashing installed by a professional service trade.

In the meantime, you may want to try a polyurethane caulking, which will stick to both types of surfaces. LePage Quad-max would be a good choice.

(Note: Do not use torch down roofing membrane under concrete; always use Duradek Tiledek.)



Tildek membranes protect the are below from leaks.



Reliable Waterproofing of Tiledek Membranes for Roof Decks Using Pavers

It is a very common scenario that roof decks surfaced with tiles or pavers result in leaks into the home below, but fortunately it is a problem that Tiledek can remedy.

Only a couple of years after Tiledek’s  introduction, TileLetter Magazine featured an article “Waterproofing Makes All The Difference In Dual Level Decks” to show how effectively Tiledek solves leak problems under exterior tile decks.

Like all Duradek membranes, Tiledek is only installed by trained and authorized contractors who are familiar with Duradek’s superior methods of reliable waterproofing. Critical areas like where the deck meets the house are addressed with Detailed Drawings for installers to reference to ensure the building envelope is protected.

In Duradek’s installation best practices, the membrane runs up the vertical wall about 6 inches and is overlapped by the moisture barrier for 2 inches to ensure that the inside perimeter, or “seam” between deck and side of the house, cannot allow any moisture to infiltrate.



Tiledek Detail Drawing IS-1T

For more information on how Tiledek can ensure you avoid leaks under tile or pavers on your rood deck projects, check out the Tiledek section our website or contact us to be referred to an authorized installer in your area.

Check out these Tiledek Case Histories for more examples!

Roof Deck Rescue by Heroes at PG Builders

Originally posted November 11, 2014

When you've got issues with a leaky flat roof deck, a good contractor with a good product is a like a real life superhero that can come to your rescue to save your home from water damage, save your bank account from repeated repairs and maintenance costs and save your sanity from leaky roof frustrations.

The heroes at PG Builders have rescued many home owners in the Washington DC area from the evils of leaky roof decks. PG Builders are the protectors of building envelopes, defeating water infiltration and dry rot. They are the fighters for justice in home renovation investment by doing the job right the first time. They are the champions of lifestyle giving home owners back the freedom to enjoy one of the most cherished parts of their home without the need for ongoing maintenance. Like most superheroes, PG Builders has a secret (or not-so-secret) weapon against water damage - Duradek vinyl membranes.

How PG Builders Rescues Roof Decks with Duradek

It is an unfortunately common story where a product presented as a lower priced solution failed. In this case it was a concrete substance over two layers of plywood and a coating over top of that. After being buried under snow for the winter, the freeze-thaw cycle can cause coatings and concrete to crack resulting in leaks.

Wood rot due to water infiltration.

Now the owner had to decide if they were going to keep spending money on Band-Aid solutions, never really solving the problem or if they were going to have to absorb the cost of a full retro-fit. These home owners chose wisely. They understood that Duradek was a reliable pedestrian roofing membrane and with the help of Duradek MidAtlantic, they were introduced to PG Builders who made sure the job was done right.

In this excellent, informative video below, you will hear from actual home owners in their own words how PG Builders came through for them by resolving their leaking roof deck issues with Duradek. Then Mike from PG Builders will explain a little bit about the project. A must-view for anyone who has a roof deck or a pedestrian roof project on their horizon!

Duradek was chosen because:

• Building code approved as both a pedestrian membrane and a roofing membrane.
• Ability to withstand extreme climate variations.
• One-time application with no re-coating required.
• 10-year waterproofing warranty.
• Attractive surface with no need for ongoing maintenance.

If you have a roof deck project in Montgomery County, PG County or the Washington D.C. area, one of the best decisions you can make is to talk to the roof deck experts at PG Builders before you spend any money on product choices that will eventually fail and cost you more in the long run. PG Builders know the specific waterproofing details required to make sure the job is done right.

Mike from PG Builders on the finished retro-fit roof deck.

In all other regions, be sure to seek out your local authorized Duradek dealer who is the only source of Duradek, the original waterproofing membrane. Selecting the right product is the right place to start and Duradek is only available through installers who have been trained in the specific details of roof deck waterproofing to make sure you get it done right the first time.

What You Need to Know to Avoid Leaky Tile Decks with Tiledek: Part 3- Installation

originally published on September 17, 2012

In part one of this four-part series of detailed questions about Duradek Ultra Tiledek membranes we first familiarized you with Tiledek and the necessity of having a reliable waterproof system under your outdoor tile decks and the typical methods of installing outdoor tile.

In part two, we discussed the alternative methods of waterproofing under exterior tile, and why Tiledek is the superior choice.

In this third part of this series we will expand on why Tiledek is the stand-out option for doing it right the first time and guaranteeing that your deck waterproofing performs as intended.

How is Tiledek installed?

Tiledek is installed using almost identical techniques to the installation of Duradek. We use the same adhesives, heat welded seams, and waterproofing details. There are a few finish details that differ due to the tile that will be installed after we are done. Here are the areas that require different techniques:

Tile Deck with Custom Flashing Details

Outside perimeters: As with regular Duradek, there are many ways to finish the outside perimeter of a tile deck. As water proofers, we need to establish what “look” the owner wants to be able to advise them properly. You should consult with both the builder and the tile setter to discuss the perimeter finish details. Depending upon their desired finish, we can alter our detailing. This is an area where we can offer our customers excellent service and help them make good waterproofing decisions while taking all the future steps they will go through into consideration. Our attention to these details contributes to the overall success of the job.

Drains: Should drains be necessary, we cannot use our regular WDD1 system. We recommend a special cast drain with a square top to make it easier and more attractive for the tile applicator to finish to.

Rail attachments: We strongly recommend attaching rails to the fascia instead of the surface of the deck. DO NOT INSTALL RAILS OVER TOP OF TILE AS IT WILL CAUSE THE OVERLAY TO CRACK. We have special details for surface mounted rails if there is no other alternative.

Proper installation required running the membrane
up the wall and "cut-in" to the brick.

Inside perimeter: If the owner wants the tile to return up the wall as part of their finished look, appropriate flashings are needed. If not, then consideration must be given to the visibility of the part of the membrane that returns up the wall and hiding the gap that must be left on the inside of the tile application.

Surface preparation: Apart from a thorough inspection for a properly fastened substrate, there is little prep work necessary. A light sanding of the joints of the cement board or a scraping of the entire surface to take care of any bumps will suffice. No filling is required.

Who installs Tiledek?

Tiledek can only be installed by a qualified Duradek applicator who has gone through our training program and who works for an authorized Duradek applicating contractor. That is how we can give our customers superior protection in making sure it is done right.

Do we recommend tile installations in cold climates?

We do not profess to be tile experts. Manufacturers of the tile and the installation accessories must answer this question. We are waterproofing professionals. We can protect the structure from water damage no matter how hot or cold or wet the climate is. And we can provide a membrane to which thinset mortars will tenaciously adhere. We cannot (and do not) guarantee tiles will not erupt as a result of freezing temperatures but we can (and do) guarantee the water that gets under the tile will not get into the building.

There are currently countless decks and balconies in cold climates being overlaid with tile. People like the look and are going to continue to use it regardless of if it is a good idea. Our part is to make sure they don’t suffer water damage.

Is Tiledek an Anti Fracture Membrane?

Example of Tiledek Assembly Build Up

Tiledek will add a very small amount of fracture resistance to the system but should not be purchased as an anti-fracture membrane. Because it is glued to the subsurface, movement beneath the Tiledek membrane may transfer through into the tile.

Will an anti-fracture membrane eliminate the need for a control joint?

It is a frequent misconception that anti-fracture membranes allow you to eliminate expansion joints - they do not. There always must be soft joints in the tile work to allow for expansion and contraction. Guidelines for expansion joint placement are given in the Tile Council of North America Handbook. The exact placement of expansion joints is a function of many items including exposure to sunlight and the range of high to low temperature, moisture, aging of the concrete (where relevant), structural movement, expected loading, and other design criteria. It is a common recommendation that there be expansion joints every 8 - 10 feet in any direction. The manufacturer's recommendations should also be consulted and followed.

On ¾ inch plywood covered with Tiledek plus a layer of Schluter’s Ditra Mat, we achieved a residential rating.

Summary

Now that you know some of the installation details to consider, check back next week for the final article in our 4-part series, “What You Need to Know to Avoid Leaky Tile Decks with Tiledek Waterproof Membrane: Part 4 – Stacking the Deck”.

What You Need to Know to Avoid Leaky Tile Decks with Tiledek Waterproof Membrane: Part 2 – The Alternatives

originally published on September 9, 2012

In part one of this four-part series of detailed questions about Duradek Ultra Tiledek membranes we explained what Tiledek is, why waterproofing is essential in outdoor tile applications, specific details on evaluations and testing results on Tiledek as a roofing membrane, and the typical methods of installing outdoor tile.

This week, we will discuss the alternative methods of waterproofing under exterior tile, and why Tiledek is the superior choice.

What does Tiledek compete with?

The answer to this question depends upon the deck being over living quarters or not.  Obviously if it is over living quarters, then the membrane must be a roofing membrane and more importantly, it must be installed with roofing principles in mind.  Should the deck not be over living quarters, there might be no building code requirement that the membrane is a roofing product but the installation details should be no less stringent considering the consequences of leaks.  Water intrusion can cause very expensive damage to the structure and we believe all waterproofing jobs demand the attention of a professional.

For the purposes of this discussion, we will separately deal with roofing and non-roofing applications.

For Roofing purposes:

Torch applied or self-adhering modified bitumen roofing materials:  
Modified Bitumen (MB) is asphalt that has had modifiers added to it to give it plastic or rubber-like properties. The most common types of modifiers being used are APP (Atactic Polypropylene) and SBS (Styrene Butadiene Styrene).

Methods of applying modified bitumen.

Rolls of modified bitumen membrane come in widths of 36" (0.9 m) to approximately 39" (1 m) and cover an area of approximately 100 square feet to 112 square feet.

Modified Bitumen roof systems consist of one, two, or three ply systems. (Base sheets with no cosmetic finish and cap sheets) The cap sheet membranes may be applied using a torch (the back of the sheet has extra asphalt on it which, when heated, bonds to the substrate) or be self adhered (removing a release paper on the back exposes a sticky surface which adheres to the substrate).

Modified bitumen
asphalt Effluence

To the best of our knowledge, none of the manufacturers of Modified Bitumen materials supports tile installations over top of the roof membrane and therefore provide no promise that it works and certainly no guarantee.  In addition, the asphalt in these products is not compatible with the mortar in the thinset or the grout lines and may bleed through causing a discoloration.

More importantly, when the MB softens as it heats up it can be compressed and may allow the tile or the grouting to crack from the movement from traffic on top.  Any product that is designed to have tile installed overtop will have test results from the Robinson test (ASTM C627) to verify it is capable of supporting weight of people and equipment.

See Tiledek Techtalk #106 – 10 Reasons Not to Use Modified Bitumen

Roof membrane plus a thickbed mortar system:

Adhering Duradek Ultra Tiledek

The traditional method of providing roofing protection under tile would be to install a suitable roofing product like PVC, epdm, tpo, modified bitumen or liquid applied urethanes, etc. with a thickbed mortar system on top to which the tile is attached.  (It is important to know whether or not the manufacturer supports the use of their product in an application like this.)  The tile may be “uncoupled” from the mortar bed or the mortar bed uncoupled from the roofing membrane or both.  There may be a drainage layer above the roofing membrane to allow any moisture that gets in to escape along the drainage plane.

This system is very expensive and quite thick (at least 1-½ inches above the membrane).  There may be as many as 7 or 8 layers involved in the system.   For examples of what they may look like, go to www.schluter.com and see their balcony details.

Either Tiledek or Duradek Ultra would make for suitable roofing membranes under this type of system.  Duradek does warranty its product for this application.

Note:  In Canada, on wood framed structures (part 9 of the National Building Code) all decks and balconies are required to use an approved roofing membrane.  

Non-roofing applications
(referred to as “waterproofing” membranes)

The first thing you will notice when researching the products that are available for waterproofing decks and balconies to which tile will be applied is the lack of the word “roofing”.  Most manufacturers of these systems want nothing to do with the details, the headaches and the liabilities involved in roofing.  You will notice details that we would not even consider using in a non-roofing application (such as finishing a membrane on the flat horizontal surface without turning it over the edge and then caulking the leading edge).  Most of the details you see are for concrete decks and balconies, not for the wood frame construction, which we are most likely to be dealing with.

 

Why is Tiledek superior to the alternatives?

As you can tell from the extensive list of other products that are available for “waterproof” applications under tile, there are very few who claim to be roofing products.  Most of the details on the websites of the products are meant for waterproofing concrete balconies and ARE NOT an “apples to apples” comparison to the kind of waterproofing we do with our materials. 

Cap welding the membrane as step 3 of
the triple heat-welded system.

We treat each and every deck as if it was a roof and we detail accordingly.  It doesn’t take much of a study to see how superior our details are.  But the most significant reason why Tiledek is superior to all the other alternatives is the network of professional applicators that install the product.  Duradek (and therefore Tiledek) is only sold through a network of businesses that have been trained.  There is no other way to get the product installed.  That means huge protection for the building owner.  THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF THE PROCESS IS THE CONTRACTOR WHO CARES ABOUT DOING IT RIGHT.

Our primary responsibility is to protect the building from water finding its way in.  Regardless of the success or possible failure of the tile overlay, we can GUARANTEE our customers that their home will be protected from water damage.

As far as the product is concerned, you can clearly see the superiority of a 60-mil layer of the same PVC we use for walking roof decks to provide the waterproofing protection needed.  Many of the systems we’ve identified are very thin layers of liquid (20 mils).  Some of the sheet systems are only 20 mils or less and even the thickest are only 40 mils.  The seams of the sheet materials are done with liquid seam sealers and we know how ineffective that has been over the years.  Some of the thicker “solutions” are very soft rubber that could allow too much movement of the tile and may promote cracks in the grout or the tile.  Clearly, Tiledek is to be considered as the superior system of waterproofing for exterior decks or balconies overlaid with tile.

If you have an outdoor tile project and would like to speak to a Tiledek professional, contact a Duradek Dealer near you.

See Tiledek Techtalk #107 – 10 Reasons to use Duradek Ultra Tiledek  and check back next week for “What You Need to Know to Avoid Leaky Tile Decks with Tiledek Waterproof Membrane: Part 3 – Installation”.

What You Need to Know to Avoid Leaky Tile Decks with Tiledek Waterproof Membrane: Part 1

Part 1 – Getting Familiar with Tiledek

Leaky tile decks are a source of frustration for many builders and homeowners throughout North America, particularly when the tile deck is above living space. However, the methods that have been used in the past without much success are no longer the only options. Duradek Ultra Tiledek was manufactured specifically to provide waterproofing peace of mind underneath exterior tile roof decks. It is the only roofing membrane specifically produced for waterproofing under outdoor tile AND that comes with a 10-year warranty that guarantees waterproof protection.

This month we will be publishing a 4-part series in a basic Q & A format every Monday to help you get acquainted with the specifics of Tiledek and waterproofing under exterior tile.

In part one, we will familiarize you with Tiledek and why it is the essential waterproofing component for outdoor tile projects.

What is Tiledek

Duradek Ultra Tiledek is a 60 mil thick, PVC roofing membrane similar to Duradek “Ultra”. It is designed to have outdoor porcelain tile or slate installed over top of it with a thinset mortar bond coat. Lightweight concrete or cementitious finishes can also be installed over it. From here on we will just refer to the overlay products as ‘tile’.

A fabric has been laminated to the topside of the roofing membrane to provide for a strong physical “grab” by the thinset mortar.  Tiledek comes in rolls 6 feet wide and 75 feet long.  Tiledek is only available as a “professionally installed waterproofing system” through the network of trained Duradek applicating contractors all over North America.

Is an outdoor tile application waterproof by itself?

Absolutely not!  It is absolutely certain that water will get under the tile.  That is precisely why there are so many problems with outdoor tile decks.  People THINK and are even misled to believe that a tile installation is waterproof and therefore they don’t pay too much attention to the proper waterproof treatment underneath. The failures are often waterproofing failures where leaks that have been happening undiscovered for years eventually cause rot requiring major renovation work.  Not only does the structure need replacement work, the tile application must also be torn up to get at it.

The water will most likely enter through cracked grout joints or on the perimeters.  If the tile cracks, water will enter.  If the deck is in a cold climate, the moisture freezes, expands and may cause tiles to erupt.

A failure in the tile installation doesn’t mean the waterproofing system has failed.  If the membrane is intact and performing its function of keeping the water out, replacing a cracked or erupted tile or a cracked grout joint is relatively easy and inexpensive.

What are Tiledek’s credentials?

Tiledek is a variation of Duradek Ultra, the first PVC walking roof deck material on the market.  Duradek Ultra has been installed for over 35 years and has proven itself in all climatic regions of North America.

Quality Auditing Institute Ltd.(QAI), an independent testing, inspection and certification agency, evaluated the Tiledek membrane (Evaluation Report T731-4), and based on this evaluation determined that Tiledek is considered compliant to the following criteria:

• ICC-ES:  Tiledek meets the requirements of ICC-ES AC39 "Acceptance Criteria for Walking Decks" and ICC-ES AC75 "Acceptance Criteria for Membrane Roof Covering Systems" as a roofing membrane when installed in accordance with the IBC 2009 or IRC 2009 and the manufacturers installation instructions.
• CAN/CGSB 37.54: Tiledek meets the requirements for conformance to the materials standard of CAN/CGSB-37.54-95 "Polyvinyl Chloride Roofing and Waterproofing Membrane" classified as a Type 3, Class A membrane.
• Class “A” Fire Rating: Tiledek is considered to have a Class “A” rating when tested to ULC-S107 "Methods of Fire Tests of Roof Coverings" and ASTM E-108 “Standard Test Methods for Fire Tests of Roof Coverings" (when installed on and covered by non-combustible building components).
• ASTM C627: Tiledek meets the requirements of the standard test method for evaluating ceramic floor installation using the Robinson-type floor tester. Test Report #UFT 2008-008, #UFT 2008-009, #UFT 2008-010.
  Test conducted by Terrazzo, Tile & Marble Association of Canada (TTMAC). 
• ANSI A118.10: Tiledek meets the requirements of the ANSI specification for load bearing, bonded, waterproof membranes for thin-set ceramic tile and dimension stone installations. Test Report #TCNA-428-10.
  Test conducted by the Tile Council of North America (TCNA).

Robinson Type Universal Floor Tester

Tiledek Techtalk #108 provides a summary of Tiledek testing and approvals in pdf format.

What is the warranty with Tiledek?

Tiledek is covered with the same waterproof warranty as Duradek Ultra – 10 years.  See the sample warranty on the Duradek website for the specific terms and conditions.

How is tile usually installed on decks and balconies?

There are two distinct methods of installing tile in waterproof applications:  thickset (using a 1-½ inch “dry mud bed”) and thinset (using a ¼ inch acrylic modified mortar).

Thickset Mortar

Thickset: Thickbed installations are based on the traditional method of packing a mortar bed over a surface before installing the tile. The tile is adhered to the mortar bed either while the mortar bed is green (just beginning to dry) or after the mortar bed has cured. The mortar bed may be reinforced with wire and either set over a cleavage membrane (that allows the mortar bed to "float" free of the substrate) or bonded to the substrate - hence the use of the terms "floating mortar bed" or "bonded mortar bed". For wall applications, metal lath is mechanically anchored to the substrate and the mortar locks into the metal lath as it cures. The terms thick-bed installation, mortar bed installation, and thickset installation are synonymous.

The thickset method is more likely to be used where the tile is thick and irregular in order to achieve a flat walking surface.

Thinset Mortar

Thinset: Thinset mortar is a blend of cement, very finely graded sand, and a water retention compound that allows the cement to properly hydrate. Tile set by the thinset method is adhered to the substrate with a thin layer of "thinset" mortar. This type of cement is designed to adhere well in a thin layer - typically not greater than 3/16th thick. For example, a 3/8" notch trowel will produce a 3/16th inch thick coating after the tiles are pressed in to the cement. While very minor adjustments in height can be made, this method is not appropriate for adjusting the level or flatness of a surface - rather the tile will follow the plane of the substrate. Only “Gauged” tiles (with similar thickness) should be used in thinset mortar applications.

Medium-set: Medium-set mortars can be used to adjust for slightly larger variations in the substrate than can be accommodated with thinset mortar. They are also used with large, heavy, thick or “ungauged” (varying thickness) tiles, where a thicker setting bed and a coarser aggregate may be required to achieve a flat installation and to support the weight of the tile while the cement is curing.

Summary

Now that you are more familiar with Tiledek and the types of outdoor tile installation methods, be sure to check back next week for part 2 in this series –“ What You Need to Know to Avoid Leaky Tile Decks with Tiledek Waterproof Membrane: Part 2 – The Alternatives”.

In the meantime, you may like more detailed information from the trained and authorized Tiledek installer in your area.

 

Leaky Deck Problems Need Experienced Contractors Who Know Waterproofing Details

When homeowners have the unfortunate experience of leaky decks (particularly if the deck is over living space), they need a contractor that knows all of the intricate details of waterproofing to solve the problem and stop the water damage from invading their homes. But what if time and time again, the problem returns? That frustration extends to further areas of your life and affects much more than just the area of your home that has been invaded by water.

All those sliding glass doors
 need waterproofing
 consideration.

When you've hired a professional to do a job, you expect the job to be done right and the problem to be solved. For Dave, one Bay Area homeowner, the roller-coaster of repairs on his second floor deck was an ongoing source of frustration that spread over 15 years...and never solved the water leak problems. Or more accurately, his water leaking problems remained unsolved until he was introduced to the Duradek solution. Duradek is installed ONLY by trained and authorized installers to ensure that all of the waterproofing details are considered.

See this real-life example of how a professional Duradek installer repaired the water leaking issues and relieved the homeowner of years of ongoing stress in this YouTube video.


Duradek Dealer, Paul from Golden Gate Enterprises is a waterproofing super-hero and has been saving water damaged homes all over the San Francisco Bay area.

When Paul assessed the project of saving this residence from the pervasive water issues, he was able to identify and isolate a few key details that perhaps previous contractors had overlooked. It was not simply a matter of laying the waterproof membrane and calling the job complete. To properly waterproof this second floor perimeter deck, Paul first:

• Raised the shingles on the deck's interior siding
• Raised all of the doors
• Installed door pans
• Installed water drains
• Re-sloped the deck to correct angle for proper drainage

For a closer look at just one aspect of the details involved, check this short YouTube clip.

Congratulations on your
new deck, Dave!
We hope you
enjoy it  for many
years to come!

For the first time in well over a decade, the homeowner was able to enjoy an entire year without any water leaking issues! He was so happy with the job that Paul and his team at Golden Gate Enterprises did on his second floor deck, that he called them back to do the work on his first level deck.